Date: Thu, 6 May 2010 18:57:06 +0000
Reply-To: toby dunn <tobydunn@HOTMAIL.COM>
Sender: "SAS(r) Discussion" <SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
From: toby dunn <tobydunn@HOTMAIL.COM>
Subject: Re: "R is an epic fail." from
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Your taking a short term outlook here. What I beleive we are talking about is more a Sun Tzu approach that wouldnt fully develop for a while. Its more of verl slow creep effect if you will that will eventually make replacing SAS a better option.
And trust me I can come up with a few scenarios where replacing SAS with something cheaper would be beneficial to th ebottom line.
"Don't bail. The best gold is at the bottom of barrels of crap."
"Be prepared. Luck is where preparation meets opportunity."
> Date: Fri, 7 May 2010 02:47:42 +0800
> From: liuwensui@GMAIL.COM
> Subject: Re: "R is an epic fail." from http://www.thejuliagroup.com/blog/?p=433
> To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> it is not really the costs related to software and hardware when we
> consider switching from sas to r in a production environment.
> do you have any idea:
> 1) how many work flows and processes have been built and maintained
> with sas in a standard large organization?
> 2) how many macros and routines have been developed and still used
> with sas in a sas workshop?
> 3) how many programmers and statisticians are not able to perform
> their daily functions due to the lack of sas?
> 4) how many training and new hiring might be necessary to complete
> this transition from sas to r?
> now, let's do the math again and re-evaluate the potential costs
> again. if we add up all of the above, then the hardware and software
> money is not unbearable at all.
> On Fri, Apr 30, 2010 at 3:50 PM, oloolo <firstname.lastname@example.org> wrote:
> > 64-bit R is about to be released, and hardware price is dropping over time
> > In the new era, SAS faces serious competition, from all elite researchers
> > of the world
> > On Thu, 29 Apr 2010 22:04:52 -0700, Mary <mlhoward@AVALON.NET> wrote:
> >>Better discussion here. I've been looking at online studies in statistics
> > lately, and noticed how strong the computer courses are oriented towards R,
> > so it is clear that there will be many graduates who have learned R rather
> > than SAS and that will make a difference in the profession. Also the move
> > to EG DOES make a difference- if statistical programmers are told to learn
> > a new environment, will they not just go to R or STATA instead of EG?
> > Currently R does have a memory limit which prevents it from being used in
> > applications with lots of records such as health care, but if it overcomes
> > that then it would be very competitive. So SAS's lack of interest in
> > supporting DM does make a difference in the competition from R.
> >>So given I may never be able to retire :-), maybe I need the masters
> > degree in statistics and the training in R that would come with it.
> >>--- peterflomconsulting@MINDSPRING.COM wrote:
> >>From: Peter Flom <peterflomconsulting@MINDSPRING.COM>
> >>To: SAS-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> >>Subject: Re: "R is an epic fail." from
> > http://www.thejuliagroup.com/blog/?p=433
> >>Date: Thu, 29 Apr 2010 18:58:57 -0400
> >>Joe Whitehurst <joewhitehurst@GMAIL.COM> wrote, quoting AnnMaria De Mars
> >>"I know that R is free and I am actually a Unix fan and think Open Source
> >>software is a great idea. However, for me personally and for most users,
> >>both individual and organizational, the much greater cost of software is
> > the time it takes to install it, maintain it, learn it and document it. On
> > that, R is an epic fail. It does NOT fit with the way the vast majority of
> > people in the world use computers."
> >>I know Ann Maria. She's a good person. But I think she goes way overboard
> > here. The "Vast majority of people" use Word, badly, and play games and
> > surf the 'net on their computers. They never do any analysis at all.
> > Obviously, Ann Maria knows that.
> >>So, "vast majority" of what population?
> >>A huge number of statisticians and data analysts use R a lot, even
> > exclusively. There are also a huge number who use SAS exclusively, or
> > almost exclusively, and probably smaller numbers for Stata and Minitab. I
> > even know some who use Matlab or LISP, and I know at least one guy who
> > makes very good graphs in Excel.
> >>I use both SAS and R. I don't want to give up either.
> >>There are, doubtless, differences in who use which program by age (R is
> > much newer than SAS), academic training, field of work, place of employment
> > and who knows what else. It would be interesting to try to find out, but
> > getting good samples would be hard.
> >>R is not an epic fail, it is already an epic success. But it is not for
> > everyone.
> >>Peter L. Flom, PhD
> >>Statistical Consultant
> >>Website: http://www DOT statisticalanalysisconsulting DOT com/
> >>Writing; http://www.associatedcontent.com/user/582880/peter_flom.html
> >>Twitter: @peterflom
> WenSui Liu
> Blog : statcompute.spaces.live.com
> Tough Times Never Last. But Tough People Do. - Robert Schuller
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