SPSSX-L archives -- June 2011 (#225)

Date:         Thu, 16 Jun 2011 10:23:56 -0400
Reply-To:     Gene Maguin <emaguin@buffalo.edu>
Sender:       "SPSSX(r) Discussion" <SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU>
From:         Gene Maguin <emaguin@buffalo.edu>
Subject:      Re: help me
In-Reply-To:  <SNT106-W2326F9120DCC779F64A715B46A0@phx.gbl>
Content-Type: multipart/alternative;

Hi Margot, 
 
No, G power won't work. I don't have enough experience to offer any more
advice. I don't understand the necessity of a post-analysis power
computation. I saw that Ryan Black posted a reply and i think his
suggestions are very much worth considering. However, if a power computation
is absolutely required you will have to find somebody where you are to do
the computation for you. 
 
Sorry, Gene Maguin
 
  _____  

From: MARGOT mh [mailto:magimarin@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, June 16, 2011 9:54 AM
To: emaguin@buffalo.edu; spssx-l@listserv.uga.edu
Subject: RE: help me



Dear Gene,
 
I have got  3 repeated measurements per subject (correlated observations),
and while they are in clusters. I have got a longitudinal study with 3
measurements are also subject groups. Then I don´t use G power???...
 
Just thank you very much for your feedback.
 
Maga

 

> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 17:16:25 -0400
> From: emaguin@buffalo.edu
> Subject: Re: help me
> To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> 
> This is a multi-part message in MIME format.
> 
> ------=_NextPart_000_002D_01CC2B7F.F4FA7F40
> Content-Type: text/plain;
> charset="us-ascii"
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit
> 
> Maga,
> 
> Why are you using GEE? What is there about your analysis or dataset that
> requires you to use GEE?
> 
> If you really have to use GEE, then the little program i mentioned won't
> work and i don't know what type of software would be required to compute
> power.
> 
> Gene Maguin
> 
> _____
> 
> From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
> MARGOT mh
> Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 5:01 PM
> To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> Subject: Re: help me
> 
> 
> Dear Gene and Evan,
> 
> Thank very much for your help me.
> 
> I got a model (GEE) with 5 independent variables (2 and 3 were categories
> were continuous covariates), these are all significant. Not consider
> covariates did not influence my model. As this analysis is an analysis of
a
> secondary database, I have requested that I submit the statistical power.
My
> English is not very good, I hope I could make myself understood.
> My understanding is that the sample is large gives a high statistical
power,
> so I do not understand is referred to the effect size.
> 
> Thanks in advance.
> 
> Maga
> 
> 
> 
> > Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 11:45:37 -0500
> > From: EHarrington@thechicagoschool.edu
> > Subject: Re: help me
> > To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> >
> > --_000_5F28CD1102E6274BA7BE4796B8EA90F50A46047431TCSTCSESORG_
> > Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > I might add to Gene's comments that large sample sizes yield high power
> (de=
> > pending on the effect size in question). Assuming that the real
population
> =
> > effect size values of your predictors are moderate in magnitude (or
> larger)=
> > then you should have high power with that sample size.
> >
> > Your question seems to be closer in meaning to a computation of the
> confide=
> > nce intervals around your estimates. Large samples yield narrow
confidence
> =
> > intervals, which one could think as having greater precision in the
> estimat=
> > e of the where the population parameters are. Again, this does not
answer
> t=
> > he "validity" question, for the same reasons Gene outlined.
> >
> >
> > Evan Harrington, Ph.D.
> > Department of Forensic Psychology
> > The Chicago School of Professional Psychology
> > 325 N. Wells Street
> > Chicago, IL 60654
> > ________________________________
> > From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Gene
> Magu=
> > in [emaguin@buffalo.edu]
> > Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 9:22 AM
> > To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> > Subject: Re: help me
> >
> > Maga,
> >
> > It sounds like you did a logistic regression with 5 predictors
> (independent=
> > variables) using data from a sample with an N of 600. You now want to
> comp=
> > ute power to show that your results are valid. I want to make two
> comments.=
> > One comment is about the power computation specifically. First of all,
> you=
> > can not do what you want using spss. You have to find something else. Do
> a=
> > search on 'statistical power logistic regression' or a set of search
> terms=
> > like that. One link is to a program called G*Power 3. I've never used
> this=
> > program, which seems to be free, but i think it could be a good option
> for=
> > you. The site is:
> http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilungen/aap/gpo=
> > wer3/
> >
> > That may get you through the power computation question itself. My
second
> c=
> > omment is about this statement "As I can estimate the statistical power
to
> =
> > conclude that my results are valid." I'm guessing that English is not
your
> =
> > first language so there may be word choice issues. A high power number
is
> n=
> > ot going to establish 'validity'. A high power number will show the
degree
> =
> > of confidence that you can have
> > that you would have found a relationship of the specified size it it
were
> r=
> > eally present. 'Validity' depends on the correctness of your
experimental
> d=
> > esign and statistical analysis logic.
> >
> > Gene Maguin
> >
> >
> >
> > ________________________________
> > From: SPSSX(r) Discussion [mailto:SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of
> MA=
> > RGOT mh
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 14, 2011 4:41 PM
> > To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU
> > Subject: help me
> >
> > Dear all,
> >
> > I have a database with 600 subjects who carried out, a secondary
> statistica=
> > l analysis with logistic regression with 5 independent variables. As I
can
> =
> > estimate the statistical power to conclude that my results are valid.
> >
> > Thank you very much for your answers
> >
> > Maga
> >
> > --_000_5F28CD1102E6274BA7BE4796B8EA90F50A46047431TCSTCSESORG_
> > Content-Type: text/html; charset="iso-8859-1"
> > Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
> >
> > <html dir=3D"ltr"><head>
> > <meta http-equiv=3D"Content-Type" content=3D"text/html;
> charset=3Diso-8859-=
> > 1">
> > <style>.hmmessage P {
> > PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN: 0px;
> P=
> > ADDING-TOP: 0px
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> > FONT-SIZE: 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma
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> > <meta content=3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.17037" name=3D"GENERATOR">
> > <style title=3D"owaParaStyle"><!--P {
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> > }
> > --></style>
> > </head>
> > <body class=3D"hmmessage" ocsi=3D"x">
> > <div dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#000000" size=3D"2">I
might
> =
> > add to Gene's comments that large sample sizes yield high power
(depending
> =
> > on the effect size in question). Assuming that the real population
effect
> s=
> > ize values of your predictors are moderate
> > in magnitude (or larger) then you should have high power with that
sample
> =
> > size.</font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"arial"></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"arial">Your question seems to be closer
in
> m=
> > eaning to a computation of the confidence intervals around your
estimates.
> =
> > Large samples yield narrow confidence intervals, which one could think
as
> h=
> > aving greater precision in the estimate
> > of the where the population parameters are. Again, this does not answer
> th=
> > e &quot;validity&quot; question, for the same reasons Gene
> outlined.</font>=
> > </div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"arial"></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr"><font face=3D"arial"></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div>
> > <div><font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"2">Evan Harrington, Ph.D.</font></div>
> > <div><font face=3D"arial" size=3D"2">Department of Forensic
> Psychology</fon=
> > t></div>
> > <div><font face=3D"arial" size=3D"2">The Chicago School of Professional
> Psy=
> > chology</font></div>
> > <div><font face=3D"arial" size=3D"2">325 N. Wells Street</font></div>
> > <div><font face=3D"arial" size=3D"2">Chicago, IL 60654</font></div>
> > </div>
> > <div id=3D"divRpF171723" style=3D"DIRECTION: ltr">
> > <hr tabindex=3D"-1">
> > <font face=3D"Tahoma" size=3D"2"><b>From:</b> SPSSX(r) Discussion
> [SPSSX-L@=
> > LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Gene Maguin [emaguin@buffalo.edu]<br>
> > <b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, June 15, 2011 9:22 AM<br>
> > <b>To:</b> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<br>
> > <b>Subject:</b> Re: help me<br>
> > </font><br>
> > </div>
> > <div></div>
> > <div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011">Maga,
> > </span></font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011"></span></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011">It sounds like you did a logistic
> regression=
> > with 5 predictors (independent variables) using data from a sample with
> an=
> > N of 600. You now want to compute power&nbsp;to
> > show that your results are valid.&nbsp;I want to make two comments.
> One&nb=
> > sp;comment is&nbsp;about the power computation specifically.&nbsp;First
of
> =
> > all, you can not do what you want using spss. You have to find something
> el=
> > se.
> > </span></font><font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#0000ff"><span
> class=3D"3142940=
> > 13-15062011">Do a search on 'statistical power logistic regression' or a
> se=
> > t of search terms like that. One link is to a program called G*Power 3.
> > </span></font><font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#0000ff"><span
> class=3D"3142940=
> > 13-15062011">I've never used this program, which seems to be
> free,&nbsp;but=
> > i think it could be a good option for you. The site is:
> > </span></font><font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#0000ff"><span
> class=3D"3142940=
> > 13-15062011"><a
> href=3D"http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilungen/aa=
> > p/gpower3/"
> target=3D"_blank">http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilun=
> > gen/aap/gpower3/</a>&nbsp;
> > </span></font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011"></span></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011">That may get you through the power
> computati=
> > on question itself. My second comment is about this statement
&quot;<font
> c=
> > olor=3D"#000000">As I can estimate the statistical
> > power to conclude that my results are valid.&quot; I'm guessing that
> Engli=
> > sh is not your first language so there may be word choice issues. A high
> po=
> > wer number is not going to establish 'validity'. A high power number
will
> s=
> > how the degree of confidence that you
> > can have</font></span></font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011"><font color=3D"#000000">that you would
have
> =
> > found a relationship of the specified size it it were really present.
> 'Vali=
> > dity' depends on the correctness of your experimental
> > design and statistical analysis logic. </font></span></font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011"></span></font>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"><spa=
> > n class=3D"314294013-15062011">Gene Maguin</span></font></div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"></fo=
> > nt>&nbsp;</div>
> > <div dir=3D"ltr" align=3D"left"><font face=3D"Arial"
> color=3D"#0000ff"></fo=
> > nt>&nbsp;</div>
> > <font face=3D"Arial" color=3D"#0000ff"></font><br>
> > <div class=3D"OutlookMessageHeader" lang=3D"en-us" dir=3D"ltr"
> align=3D"lef=
> > t">
> > <hr tabindex=3D"-1">
> > <font face=3D"Tahoma"><b>From:</b> SPSSX(r) Discussion
> [mailto:SPSSX-L@LIST=
> > SERV.UGA.EDU]
> > <b>On Behalf Of </b>MARGOT mh<br>
> > <b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, June 14, 2011 4:41 PM<br>
> > <b>To:</b> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<br>
> > <b>Subject:</b> help me<br>
> > </font><br>
> > </div>
> > <div></div>
> > <font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"3">Dear all,</font><br>
> > <font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"3"></font>&nbsp;<br>
> > <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; VERTICAL-ALIGN:
top;
> L=
> > INE-HEIGHT: normal">
> > <span lang=3D"EN" style=3D"COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY:
> 'Arial','sans-serif'"=
> > ><font size=3D"3">I have a database with 600 subjects who carried out, a
> se=
> > condary statistical analysis with logistic regression with 5 independent
> va=
> > riables. As I can estimate the statistical
> > power to conclude that my results are valid.</font></span></p>
> > <p class=3D"MsoNormal" style=3D"MARGIN: 0cm 0cm 0pt; VERTICAL-ALIGN:
top;
> L=
> > INE-HEIGHT: normal">
> > <span lang=3D"EN" style=3D"COLOR: black; FONT-FAMILY:
> 'Arial','sans-serif'"=
> > ><br>
> > <font size=3D"3">Thank you very much for your answers</font></span><span
> la=
> > ng=3D"EN-GB" style=3D"FONT-SIZE: 9pt; COLOR: #888888; FONT-FAMILY:
> 'Arial',=
> > 'sans-serif'"></span></p>
> > <font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"3"></font>&nbsp;<br>
> > <font face=3D"Arial" size=3D"3">Maga</font><br>
> > </div>
> > </body>
> > </html>
> >
> > --_000_5F28CD1102E6274BA7BE4796B8EA90F50A46047431TCSTCSESORG_--
> >
> > =====================
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> 
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> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011>Maga, </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011>Why are you using&nbsp;GEE? What is there =
> about your=20
> analysis or dataset that requires you to use GEE?</SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011>If you really have to use GEE, then the =
> little program=20
> i mentioned won't work and i don't know what type of software would be =
> required=20
> to compute power. </SPAN></FONT></DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011></SPAN></FONT>&nbsp;</DIV>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr align=3Dleft><FONT color=3D#0000ff face=3DArial><SPAN=20
> class=3D604241121-15062011>Gene Maguin</SPAN></FONT></DIV><BR>
> <DIV dir=3Dltr lang=3Den-us class=3DOutlookMessageHeader align=3Dleft>
> <HR tabIndex=3D-1>
> <FONT face=3DTahoma><B>From:</B> SPSSX(r) Discussion=20
> [mailto:SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] <B>On Behalf Of </B>MARGOT =
> mh<BR><B>Sent:</B>=20
> Wednesday, June 15, 2011 5:01 PM<BR><B>To:</B>=20
> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<BR><B>Subject:</B> Re: help =
> me<BR></FONT><BR></DIV>
> <DIV></DIV>Dear Gene and Evan,<BR>&nbsp;<BR>Thank very much for your =
> help me.=20
> <BR>&nbsp;<BR><SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1079">I</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1080">got</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1081">a model</SPAN> <SPAN class=3D"hps atn"=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1082">(</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1083">GEE</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1084">) with</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1085">5</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1086">independent</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1087">variables</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1088">(2</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1089">and</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1090">3</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1091">were</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1092">categories</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1093">were</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1094">continuous covariates</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1095">)</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1096">,</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1097">these are all</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1098">significant</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1099">.</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1100">Not</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1101">consider</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1102">covariates</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1103">did not influence</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1104">my model</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1105">.</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1106">As</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1107">this</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1108">analysis</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1109">is</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1110">an</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1111">analysis of</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1112">a</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1113">secondary database</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1114">,</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1115">I</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1116">have requested</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1117">that</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1118">I</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1119">submit</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1120">the statistical power</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1121">.</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1122">My</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1123">English</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1124">is not</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1125">very</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1126">good</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1127">,</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1128">I hope I</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1129">could</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1130">make myself understood.</SPAN><BR=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1151"><SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1131">My understanding</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1132">is</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1133">that</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1134">the</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1135">sample</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1136">is</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1137">large</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1138">gives</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1139">a</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1140">high</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1141">statistical power</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1142">,</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1143">so</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1144">I do not understand</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps =
> 
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1145">is</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1146">referred to</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1147">the</SPAN> <SPAN class=3Dhps=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1148">effect size</SPAN><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1149">.</SPAN><BR><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1149"></SPAN>&nbsp;<BR><SPAN=20
> title=3D"Haz clic para obtener otras posibles traducciones"=20
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1149">Thanks in advance.<BR><BR>Maga</SPAN><BR><BR =
> 
> closure_uid_gabdcu=3D"1152"><BR>&nbsp;<BR>&gt; Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2011 =
> 11:45:37=20
> -0500<BR>&gt; From: EHarrington@thechicagoschool.edu<BR>&gt; Subject: =
> Re: help=20
> me<BR>&gt; To: SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;=20
> --_000_5F28CD1102E6274BA7BE4796B8EA90F50A46047431TCSTCSESORG_<BR>&gt;=20
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=3D"iso-8859-1"<BR>&gt;=20
> Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I might add =
> to=20
> Gene's comments that large sample sizes yield high power (de=3D<BR>&gt; =
> pending on=20
> the effect size in question). Assuming that the real population =
> =3D<BR>&gt; effect=20
> size values of your predictors are moderate in magnitude (or =
> larger)=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> then you should have high power with that sample size.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; =
> Your=20
> question seems to be closer in meaning to a computation of the =
> confide=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> nce intervals around your estimates. Large samples yield narrow =
> confidence=20
> =3D<BR>&gt; intervals, which one could think as having greater precision =
> in the=20
> estimat=3D<BR>&gt; e of the where the population parameters are. Again, =
> this does=20
> not answer t=3D<BR>&gt; he "validity" question, for the same reasons =
> Gene=20
> outlined.<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Evan Harrington, Ph.D.<BR>&gt; =
> Department of=20
> Forensic Psychology<BR>&gt; The Chicago School of Professional=20
> Psychology<BR>&gt; 325 N. Wells Street<BR>&gt; Chicago, IL 60654<BR>&gt; =
> 
> ________________________________<BR>&gt; From: SPSSX(r) Discussion=20
> [SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Gene Magu=3D<BR>&gt; in=20
> [emaguin@buffalo.edu]<BR>&gt; Sent: Wednesday, June 15, 2011 9:22 =
> AM<BR>&gt; To:=20
> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<BR>&gt; Subject: Re: help me<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;=20
> Maga,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; It sounds like you did a logistic regression with =
> 5=20
> predictors (independent=3D<BR>&gt; variables) using data from a sample =
> with an N=20
> of 600. You now want to comp=3D<BR>&gt; ute power to show that your =
> results are=20
> valid. I want to make two comments.=3D<BR>&gt; One comment is about the =
> power=20
> computation specifically. First of all, you=3D<BR>&gt; can not do what =
> you want=20
> using spss. You have to find something else. Do a=3D<BR>&gt; search on=20
> 'statistical power logistic regression' or a set of search =
> terms=3D<BR>&gt; like=20
> that. One link is to a program called G*Power 3. I've never used =
> this=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> program, which seems to be free, but i think it could be a good option=20
> for=3D<BR>&gt; you. The site is:=20
> http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilungen/aap/gpo=3D<BR>&gt; =
> wer3/<BR>&gt;=20
> <BR>&gt; That may get you through the power computation question itself. =
> My=20
> second c=3D<BR>&gt; omment is about this statement "As I can estimate =
> the=20
> statistical power to =3D<BR>&gt; conclude that my results are valid." =
> I'm guessing=20
> that English is not your =3D<BR>&gt; first language so there may be word =
> choice=20
> issues. A high power number is n=3D<BR>&gt; ot going to establish =
> 'validity'. A=20
> high power number will show the degree =3D<BR>&gt; of confidence that =
> you can=20
> have<BR>&gt; that you would have found a relationship of the specified =
> size it=20
> it were r=3D<BR>&gt; eally present. 'Validity' depends on the =
> correctness of your=20
> experimental d=3D<BR>&gt; esign and statistical analysis logic.<BR>&gt; =
> <BR>&gt;=20
> Gene Maguin<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; <BR>&gt;=20
> ________________________________<BR>&gt; From: SPSSX(r) Discussion=20
> [mailto:SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of MA=3D<BR>&gt; RGOT =
> mh<BR>&gt; Sent:=20
> Tuesday, June 14, 2011 4:41 PM<BR>&gt; To: =
> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU<BR>&gt;=20
> Subject: help me<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; Dear all,<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; I have a =
> database=20
> with 600 subjects who carried out, a secondary statistica=3D<BR>&gt; l =
> analysis=20
> with logistic regression with 5 independent variables. As I can =
> =3D<BR>&gt;=20
> estimate the statistical power to conclude that my results are =
> valid.<BR>&gt;=20
> <BR>&gt; Thank you very much for your answers<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; =
> Maga<BR>&gt;=20
> <BR>&gt; =
> --_000_5F28CD1102E6274BA7BE4796B8EA90F50A46047431TCSTCSESORG_<BR>&gt;=20
> Content-Type: text/html; charset=3D"iso-8859-1"<BR>&gt; =
> Content-Transfer-Encoding:=20
> quoted-printable<BR>&gt; <BR>&gt; &lt;html =
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;head&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;meta http-equiv=3D3D"Content-Type" content=3D3D"text/html;=20
> charset=3D3Diso-8859-=3D<BR>&gt; 1"&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;style&gt;.hmmessage =
> P {<BR>&gt;=20
> PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 0px; PADDING-BOTTOM: 0px; MARGIN: 0px; =
> 
> P=3D<BR>&gt; ADDING-TOP: 0px<BR>&gt; }<BR>&gt; BODY.hmmessage {<BR>&gt; =
> FONT-SIZE:=20
> 10pt; FONT-FAMILY: Tahoma<BR>&gt; }<BR>&gt; &lt;/style&gt;<BR>&gt; =
> &lt;meta=20
> content=3D3D"MSHTML 6.00.6000.17037" name=3D3D"GENERATOR"&gt;<BR>&gt; =
> &lt;style=20
> title=3D3D"owaParaStyle"&gt;&lt;!--P {<BR>&gt; MARGIN-TOP: 0px; =
> MARGIN-BOTTOM:=20
> 0px<BR>&gt; }<BR>&gt; --&gt;&lt;/style&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;/head&gt;<BR>&gt; =
> 
> &lt;body class=3D3D"hmmessage" ocsi=3D3D"x"&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" color=3D3D"#000000" =
> size=3D3D"2"&gt;I might=20
> =3D<BR>&gt; add to Gene's comments that large sample sizes yield high =
> power=20
> (depending =3D<BR>&gt; on the effect size in question). Assuming that =
> the real=20
> population effect s=3D<BR>&gt; ize values of your predictors are =
> moderate<BR>&gt;=20
> in magnitude (or larger) then you should have high power with that =
> sample=20
> =3D<BR>&gt; size.&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div =
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;font=20
> face=3D3D"arial"&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"arial"&gt;Your question seems to be =
> closer in=20
> m=3D<BR>&gt; eaning to a computation of the confidence intervals around =
> your=20
> estimates. =3D<BR>&gt; Large samples yield narrow confidence intervals, =
> which one=20
> could think as h=3D<BR>&gt; aving greater precision in the =
> estimate<BR>&gt; of the=20
> where the population parameters are. Again, this does not answer =
> th=3D<BR>&gt; e=20
> &amp;quot;validity&amp;quot; question, for the same reasons Gene=20
> outlined.&lt;/font&gt;=3D<BR>&gt; &lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;font=20
> face=3D3D"arial"&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> dir=3D3D"ltr"&gt;&lt;font=20
> face=3D3D"arial"&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" =
> size=3D3D"2"&gt;Evan=20
> Harrington, Ph.D.&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div&gt;&lt;font=20
> face=3D3D"arial" size=3D3D"2"&gt;Department of Forensic =
> Psychology&lt;/fon=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> t&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"arial" =
> size=3D3D"2"&gt;The=20
> Chicago School of Professional Psy=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> chology&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div&gt;&lt;font =
> face=3D3D"arial"=20
> size=3D3D"2"&gt;325 N. Wells Street&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;div&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"arial" size=3D3D"2"&gt;Chicago, IL=20
> 60654&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> id=3D3D"divRpF171723" style=3D3D"DIRECTION: ltr"&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;hr=20
> tabindex=3D3D"-1"&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;font face=3D3D"Tahoma"=20
> size=3D3D"2"&gt;&lt;b&gt;From:&lt;/b&gt; SPSSX(r) Discussion =
> [SPSSX-L@=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> LISTSERV.UGA.EDU] On Behalf Of Gene Maguin=20
> [emaguin@buffalo.edu]&lt;br&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;b&gt;Sent:&lt;/b&gt; =
> Wednesday, June=20
> 15, 2011 9:22 AM&lt;br&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;b&gt;To:&lt;/b&gt;=20
> SPSSX-L@LISTSERV.UGA.EDU&lt;br&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;b&gt;Subject:&lt;/b&gt; =
> Re: help=20
> me&lt;br&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;/font&gt;&lt;br&gt;<BR>&gt; =
> &lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;div&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div =
> dir=3D3D"ltr"=20
> align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" =
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> n class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;Maga,<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div dir=3D3D"ltr"=20
> align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" =
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> n=20
> class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt=
> ;/div&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;div dir=3D3D"ltr" align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial"=20
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt; n =
> class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;It=20
> sounds like you did a logistic regression=3D<BR>&gt; with 5 predictors=20
> (independent variables) using data from a sample with an=3D<BR>&gt; N of =
> 600. You=20
> now want to compute power&amp;nbsp;to<BR>&gt; show that your results are =
> 
> valid.&amp;nbsp;I want to make two comments. One&amp;nb=3D<BR>&gt; =
> sp;comment=20
> is&amp;nbsp;about the power computation specifically.&amp;nbsp;First of=20
> =3D<BR>&gt; all, you can not do what you want using spss. You have to =
> find=20
> something el=3D<BR>&gt; se.<BR>&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;font=20
> face=3D3D"Arial" color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;span =
> class=3D3D"3142940=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> 13-15062011"&gt;Do a search on 'statistical power logistic regression' =
> or a=20
> se=3D<BR>&gt; t of search terms like that. One link is to a program =
> called G*Power=20
> 3.<BR>&gt; &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial"=20
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;span class=3D3D"3142940=3D<BR>&gt; =
> 13-15062011"&gt;I've=20
> never used this program, which seems to be free,&amp;nbsp;but=3D<BR>&gt; =
> i think=20
> it could be a good option for you. The site is:<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" =
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;span=20
> class=3D3D"3142940=3D<BR>&gt; 13-15062011"&gt;&lt;a=20
> href=3D3D"http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilungen/aa=3D<BR>&gt; =
> p/gpower3/"=20
> target=3D3D"_blank"&gt;http://www.psycho.uni-duesseldorf.de/abteilun=3D<B=
> R>&gt;=20
> gen/aap/gpower3/&lt;/a&gt;&amp;nbsp;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div dir=3D3D"ltr"=20
> align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial" =
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> n=20
> class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&amp;nbsp;&lt=
> ;/div&gt;<BR>&gt;=20
> &lt;div dir=3D3D"ltr" align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial"=20
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt; n =
> class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;That may=20
> get you through the power computati=3D<BR>&gt; on question itself. My =
> second=20
> comment is about this statement &amp;quot;&lt;font c=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> olor=3D3D"#000000"&gt;As I can estimate the statistical<BR>&gt; power to =
> conclude=20
> that my results are valid.&amp;quot; I'm guessing that Engli=3D<BR>&gt; =
> sh is not=20
> your first language so there may be word choice issues. A high =
> po=3D<BR>&gt; wer=20
> number is not going to establish 'validity'. A high power number will =
> s=3D<BR>&gt;=20
> how the degree of confidence that you<BR>&gt; can=20
> have&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div=20
> dir=3D3D"ltr" align=3D3D"left"&gt;&lt;font face=3D3D"Arial"=20
> color=3D3D"#0000ff"&gt;&lt;spa=3D<BR>&gt; n =
> class=3D3D"314294013-15062011"&gt;&lt;font=20
> color=3D3D"#000000"&gt;that you would have =3D<BR>&gt; found a =
> relationship of the=20
> specified size it it were really present. 'Vali=3D<BR>&gt; dity' depends =
> on the=20
> correctness of your experimental<BR>&gt; design and statistical analysis =
> logic.=20
> &lt;/font&gt;&lt;/span&gt;&lt;/font&gt;&lt;/div&gt;<BR>&gt; &lt;div =
> dir=3D3D"ltr"=20
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> have a database with 600 subjects who carried out, a se=3D<BR>&gt; =
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