Two messages on UK's sub-countries.----------Johnnie
 
-----------------------------------------
 
 
      Thu, 9 Dec 93 15:07:33 EST
      Ardis Hanson(ADM) <[log in to unmask]>
         Re: Scotland and Wales
 
comments on Mr. Geography's point #1 about Wales...
        yes, unfortunately Cymru has also suffered the inimitable English
arrogance of
abolishing language/customs (English only schools and media) as well as major
exploitation of its peoples (coal as just one example), so from a nationalist
POV, Cymru an byth! Go Clan Donald!  Sassenach get back to whence ye came.
 
 
>           Thu,  9 Dec 1993 10:17 EST
>           "Mr. Geography" <EDNEY@BINGVAXA>
>           RE: Scotland and Wales
>
>
> Just to fine-tune the two recent answers to the question of England, Wales,
> and Scotland. ...
>
> 1. Wales was annexed during the eleventh and twelfth centuries by Anglo-Norman
> (later English) barons who owed fealty to the English King.  (One of these,
> the Earl of Pembroke, was responsible for the first English presence in
Ireland
> which led to Henry II proclaiming his son John, Lord of Ireland in 1180 or
so.)
> King Edward I imposed royal authority and so Wales was merged with England; it
> therefore shares the English educational and legal systems.
>
> 2. The continuation of separate Scottish currencies (Bank of Sc.; Royal Bank
of
> Sc.; Clydesdale Bank, etc.) does not reflect sovereignty.  Before 1800, any
> bank in Great Britain (Engalnd + Wales + Scotland) could issue bank notes if
> they had gold bullion.  In 1819 or so, parliament passed a law which said that
> if any bank-note-issuing bank went broke, then its gold and associated
banknotes
> would revert to the Bank of England.  All the English and Welsh banks have
long
> since folded, but the four or so Scottish banks have not, for purely
historical
> circumstances.
>
> 3. The separate postal stamps and currencies of the Channel Isles, Isle of
Man,
> and Northern Ireland, DO reflect sovereignty and their separate status within
> the U.K.
>
> 4. And then there is the wonderful cases of Monmouthshire and Berwick-upon-
> Tweed.  Monmouthshire has shuttled between England and Wales according to who
> knows what criteria.  Berwick similarly between England and Scotland.  If I
> remember the trivia aright, Berwick is still at war with France.  When G.B.
> declared war on France in 1794, it was "Kingdoms of England and Scotland, and
> Berwick-upon-Tweed"; the peace of 1816 (18?) said only "Kingdoms of England
> and Scotland."
>
> I hope this is not too clarifying.
>
> Matthew Edney
>
 
 
-------------------------------------------
 
 
      Fri, 10 Dec 93 11:11 GMT
      [log in to unmask]
         RE: Scotland and Wales
 
With reference to point 3 by Matthew Edney :
 
While Northern Ireland is part of the United Kingdom, the Isle of Man
and the Channel Islands are not part of the United Kingdom, they are
known as Crown dependencies. Crown dependencies are self governing
often with their own parliamentary, legal and administrative systems;
the Crown is responsible for international relations and defence.
 
 
Bob McIntosh