-------- Original Message --------
Subject: Fwd: Re: Digital Map Feedback,The New US Topo Maps
Date: Wed, 07 Dec 2011 15:21:35 -0800
From: Carlos Diaz <[log in to unmask]>
To: [log in to unmask], DOCTECH-L <[log in to unmask]>,
[log in to unmask]
Earlier today, I had some questions about the US Topo maps. The USGS
promptly sent me a response to my inquiries already.
Scroll to the bottom of the email to read my email to them before
reading the response they sent me at the top of the message.
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The original USGS topographic map series (1945-1992) included several
feature classes that are not yet shown on US Topos. Examples include
railroads, recreational trails, pipelines, power lines, survey markers,
PLSS, and many types of buildings. In all cases, the problem is that
there are no national data sources suitable for general-purpose,
1:24,000-scale maps. For many of these feature classes, USGS is working
with other agencies to develop data or adapt existing data. Over time as
these data become available and included in The National Map they will be
added to US Topo. For an overview of the program and the philosophy of US
Topo content, see the article at
http://www.directionsmag.com/articles/us-topo-a-new-national-map-series/178707
> ...boundaries and boundary names...
State, county, and national boundaries were added to the product in
mid-2010. National Forest boundaries were added in early 2011. We are
working on more federal land boundaries (National Parks, Wildlife Refuges,
military reservations...), but again the problem is the availability of
national datasets suitable for 1:24,000-scale maps.
> there is no green color to show vegetation
A green timber layer was added in October 2011, starting with Maine.
> Because of the orthophoto on the map, it makes it harder to see the
contour
> intervals on the maps.
This is true, but we consider it a feature, not a bug. The orthoimage and
the contours both have value, even though they can't really be used
together. As more feature classes are added to the maps, the problem will
get worse. This is why the product is organized in layers, so users can
select the content they want to see or print.
> ...where it defaults to the drawing instead of the photo image.
This was a design change made in late 2010. As the non-image content of
the product has increased, a default display of all layers became too
cluttered. Because the image takes the longest to paint, we decided to
leave it off by default and present the initial view of a traditional line
map. As more layers are added, others will probably be turned off by
default.
> You no longer show township and range information and boundaries.
Again, the problem is lack of suitable national databases. BLM is the
authoritative source for PLSS data; we are working with them and hope to
start adding these data for the western states in late 2012. The eastern
states are much more problematic because there is no central data
authority, and we do not yet have specific plans for PLSS in eastern
states.
> I also wanted to ask you why you changed from 40' contour intervals to
20'
Contours are generated from the gridded data of the National Elevation
Database (NED). The rule of thumb is that we use the same contour interval
that was on the legacy map, but there are some intentional exceptions, and
also some quads produced with the wrong interval by mistake. Most of
these mistakes (on the order of 800 quads out of about 40,000 produced so
far) are known, and were let go on the grounds that the errors are not
fatal -- not important enough to "back up" the production schedule.
However, each month we remake a few dozen maps to correct very serious
errors; if you send me the name(s) of the quads you are concerned about,
we will evaluate them for immediate rework.
An effect of all these things is that the US Topo product is not, and
never will be, stable the way the old maps were. The strategic goal of
the program is to refresh the entire set of 54,000 maps on a 3-year cycle,
using the best data available at the time of map production. Continuous
improvement is another important objective. We are already on the second
cycle, and are currently republishing maps in Maine, Alabama, Arizona,
Nebraska, and Missouri that were first produced in 2009. The new maps are
quite different, and we believe much improved, from the 2009 maps, and we
expect the same will be true when the same cells are produced again in
2014-15.
> When I tried opening up Reecer Canyon on a different computer with a
library
> patron in front of me, it would only show me a sliver of the photo
image.
I looked at this quad, and could find nothing obviously wrong with it.
Without knowing a lot more about your computers, I can only make some
guesses. Layers are a relatively new feature of the PDF standard, and not
very much software yet implements them completely and correctly. In
addition, US Topo files are relatively large and complex PDF documents.
The display behavior is therefore somewhat sensitive to the software you
are using, and the version of that software. If you are using Acrobat
Reader version 9.0 or later, the images should display correctly. Earlier
versions of Reader, or non-Adobe software may display the files correctly,
but we are much less confident (I use Linux a lot, and have yet to find a
non-Adobe PDF reader for that OS that can deal with the US Topo layer
structure; this is a lack of robustness in the PDF readers, not an error
in the data files.) Another possibility, though not a likely one, is file
corruption during copy and transfer processes. Since the file displays
correctly for you on one computer but not on another, I would first look
at software versions on the second computer, then test for file
corruption, then maybe check on things like adequate memory for files this
large.
-------------------------
Larry Moore
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From:
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To:
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Cc:
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Date:
12/07/2011 12:30 PM
Subject:
Digital Map Feedback,The New US Topo Maps
Transaction=GSFTJC6Y [07DEC2011 19:30:13UTC]
Customer email: [log in to unmask]
Customer: Carlos A. Diaz
Subject: Digital Map Feedback,The New US Topo Maps
Originating page: http://nationalmap.gov/ustopo/ustopo_feedback.html
Primary response: [log in to unmask]
USGS PERSONNEL: This email was generated through the Contact USGS system.
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========================================================
Dear USGS,
I find the new topo. maps format very frustrating. I have downloaded them
so we can print them out onto our maps plotter and make them available for
our library patrons.
One of the most frustrating things is the fact that you don't have
boundaries and boundary names for counties on the maps even though you are
supposed to have them on the geo.pdf formats. You don't even include
the county name(s) on the header of the map any more. There is also no
publishing date like there used to be at the bottom of the frame of the
map. These are important details that allow faculty, students, and
researchers to properly cite the maps and make them available and
accessible via library catalogs.
You have also removed wilderness area names and locality and such where it
once used to be on the older maps.
Because of the orthophoto on the map, it makes it harder to see the
contour intervals on the maps. Only by removing the orthophoto can you
view the detail and even when you do so, there is no green color to show
vegetation (I am assuming this is where the photo part comes in).
You no longer show township and range information and boundaries. Again,
very helpful information for faculty, students, researchers and the
general public.
Where is the gain in removing all this vital information?
I also found at least a couple of maps,
Reecer Canyon, WA (gda_5267306)and Blewett Pass, WA (gda_5267661)where it
defaults to the drawing instead of the photo image. Vancouver, WA and
Walla Walla, WA do the same thing. When I tried opening up Reecer Canyon
on a different computer with a library patron in front of me, it would
only show me a sliver of the photo image. My desk computer, on the other
hand, the photo image had no trouble showing up but it continues to
default to the drawing and not the photo image.
I also wanted to ask you why you changed from 40' contour intervals to
20' contour intervals for the new ones.
Any help you can give me would be most appreciated.
,-~~-.___.
/ | ' \ "The needs of the many outweigh the needs of
( ) 0 the few or the one."
\_/-, ,----'
==== // Mr. Spock
/ \-'~; /~~~(O) Star Trek: The Wrath of Khan
/ __/~| / |
=( _____| (_________|
Carlos A. Diaz
Government Publications, Maps, and Microforms
James E. Brooks Library
Central Washington University
Mailstop 7548
Ellensburg, WA 98926
[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>
http://www.lib.cwu.edu/government-publications/
Carlos' phone: (509) 963-1545
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