-------- Original Message --------
Subject:        Re: The decline and fall of the descriptive gazetteer
Date:   Wed, 15 Jan 2014 19:23:02 +0000
From:   humphrey <[log in to unmask]>
To:     Angie Cope, American Geographical Society Library, UW Milwaukee
<[log in to unmask]>



I don’t know much about Chinese gazetteers — but that is precisely why
Peter Bol at Harvard is my co-author on this chapter.

I am very aware that there are other parts of the world besides N
America, W Europe and China, and would be very interested in comments on
them …

Humphrey

On 15 Jan 2014, at 18:54, Angie Cope, American Geographical Society
Library, UW Milwaukee <[log in to unmask] <mailto:[log in to unmask]>> wrote:

>
> ------- Original Message --------
> Subject:      Re: The decline and fall of the descriptive gazetteer
> Date:         Wed, 15 Jan 2014 12:37:46 -0500
> From:         Joel Kovarsky <[log in to unmask]>
> To:   Maps, Air Photo, GIS Forum - Map Librarianship
> <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
>
> I am assuming your focus is on Western European gazetteers, and
> perhaps more focused on those British. Their history in China may be
> older:
> <http://www.jstor.org/discover/10.2307/2719404?uid=3739936&uid=2&uid=4&uid=3739256&sid=21103277674257>
> and
> <http://www.emeraldinsight.com/journals.htm?articleid=17066178&show=abstract>
> . Given my lack of linguistic skill, I have no idea how these
> structurally compare to later western counterparts, although looking
> at that paper it appears they tended to be quite regional.
>
> Given your ongoing and extensive involvement with this subject, it
> would not surprise me if you already knew this.
>
>
>                 Joel Kovarsky
>
> On 1/15/2014 12:15 PM, Angie Cope, American Geographical Society
> Library, UW Milwaukee wrote:
>>
>> forwarded by Angie
>>
>> -------- Original Message --------
>> Subject:     The decline and fall of the descriptive gazetteer
>> Date:        Wed, 15 Jan 2014 16:27:32 +0000
>> From:        humphrey <[log in to unmask]>
>> Reply-To:    A forum for issues related to map & spatial data
>> librarianship <[log in to unmask]>
>> To:  [log in to unmask]
>>
>>
>>
>> As some members of this list will know, I am co-editing a book about
>> gazetteers, especially future digital gazetteers; but also authoring
>> an introductory chapter which looks at the history of gazetteers, a
>> surprisingly little explored topic.
>>
>> Our general point is that, although most people’s idea of a gazetteer
>> is simply a list of geographical names each with some kind of
>> coordinate and sometime with a simple “feature type”, like
>> “settlement” or “mountain”, there is an earlier history of gazetteers
>> which provide lengthy descriptions of each place/feature.
>>
>> We have computerised several of these for our web site, A Vision of
>> Britain through Time, and are currently working on tidying up the
>> seven-volume "/Gazetteer of the World, or Dictionary of Geographical
>> Knowledge,/published by Fullarton's of Edinburgh in 1856; this has
>> already been digitised within Google Books, but we are turning it
>> into clean database content. We estimate it contains around 80,000
>> entries and 7m words, so the average entry is a couple of sentences,
>> and many go on for several pages. Similarly, this “entry” for
>> Edinburgh in Groome’s /Ordnance Gazetteer of Scotland/ (1882-4)
>> contains over 100,000 words:
>>
>> http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/descriptions/108700
>>
>> SUCH BOOKS ARE NOT SO MUCH PLACE DICTIONARIES AS PLACE
>> ENCYCLOPAEDIAS. I HAVE BEEN EXPLORING THEIR EARLY HISTORY, BUT THIS
>> POSTING IS TO ASK ABOUT THEIR LATER HISTORY, AFTER 1900.
>>
>> My basic narrative at the moment is that descriptive gazetteers, as
>> distinct from itineraries, first appear in the mid to late
>> seventeenth century, and the lengthiest examples come from the second
>> half of the nineteenth century — but they then pretty much stop —
>> when I have looked at the shelves of gazetteers in various libraries
>> I have mainly seen books from the 19th century, occasionally earlier.
>>
>> The exceptions seem to be:
>>
>> — There are of course lots of atlases which also include a gazetteer
>> at the back (but this is about books which are primarily text)
>>
>> — Bartholomew have kept publishing revised editions of their
>> Gazetteer of the British Isles (but that has relatively short
>> entries, so more a place dictionary than an encyclopaedia).
>>
>> — Various guides aimed mainly at tourists are organised as sets of
>> alphabetically arranged entries about places, with descriptions; for
>> example, various Shell Guides. However, map libraries are less likely
>> to hold these.
>>
>> IS THIS A FAIR NARRATIVE? WHAT HAPPENED TO THE BIG DESCRIPTIVE
>> GAZETTEERS AFTER 1900?
>>
>> One suggestion is that they were supplanted by broader
>> encyclopaedias, a substantial fraction of whose headwords are
>> typically toponyms. I have sometimes suggested that the world’s
>> biggest and most widely used digital gazetteer is now Wikipedia; I
>> once sampled 100 randomly selected Wikipedia articles, and about 30%
>> had an associated global coordinate.
>>
>> I WOULD BE VERY GRATEFUL FOR ANY THOUGHTS ANYONE HAS. I continue to
>> find it bizarre that so much has been written about the history of
>> maps and so little about the history of gazetteers and itineraries.
>>
>> With thanks,
>>
>> Humphrey Southall
>>
>> Reader in Geography/
>> Director, GB Historical GIS
>> University of Portsmouth
>> Geography Dept, Buckingham Bldg,
>> Lion Terrace, Portsmouth PO1 3HE, UK
>> www.gbhgis.org <http://www.gbhgis.org/> & www.visionofbritain.org.uk
>> <http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/>
>>
>>
>
> --
> Joel Kovarsky
> The Prime Meridian
> 1839 Clay Dr., Crozet, VA 22932 USA
> Phone: 434-823-5696
> Email:[log in to unmask]
> Website:http://www.theprimemeridian.com
>
>

Humphrey Southall
Reader in Geography/
Director, GB Historical GIS
University of Portsmouth
Geography Dept, Buckingham Bldg,
Lion Terrace, Portsmouth PO1 3HE, UK
www.gbhgis.org <http://www.gbhgis.org/> & www.visionofbritain.org.uk
<http://www.visionofbritain.org.uk/>