I am surprised that most messages on this thread continue to discuss Conus
clytospira and C. milneedwardsi as separate species. I will not enter that
debate but wish to reply to the query about Conus kawamurai (Habe, 1962).
Conus kawamurai is considered to be a junior synonym of Conus aratispira
Pilsbry, 1894. It is found only in the later Tertiary and Recent fauna of
Japan. This synonymy is discussed in detail by Callomon, 2000, Venus 59:
59-60.
dick
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lyle Therriault" <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Thursday, June 02, 2005 9:09 PM
Subject: Re: Conus milneedwardsi - why no nominative form?
>I guess it would be true to some extent that both milneedwardsi and
> clytospira can reach large proportions, tho in my own experiences i have
> seen many more very large milneedwardsi than I have clytospira....again I
> would tend to agree that on a whole both species would reach large sizes
> but i do think that milneedwardsi reaches those sizes more
> frequently....maybe I should word it like that.
>
> I do have a Red Sea version of milneedwardsi....trusting the data on the
> slip...looks just like any milneedwardsi that would come from someplace
> other than the Red Sea. Really no difference in size, coloration or
> pattern
> that is noticable. And I dont have enough specimens to really do a fair
> study on them either to see if there was any differences from specimens
> taken in the Red Sea area.
>
> One would have to presume, albeit sight unseen at least from here in the
> US, that the holotype would be a juvenile specimen at 46 mm. I have seen
> some specimens in the 60mm+ range like Carlos mentioned but the ones I
> have
> seen didnt seem to be fully "developed" for lack of a better word they
> were more than likely "older teenage" specimens , not juveniles but not
> fully adult either. Perhaps another subspecies? Does anyone know for sure
> if form kawamurai is strictly found in Japanese waters, or can it be
> found
> elsewhere.
>
> Does anyone else have any thoughts on this? I am curious to know if anyone
> else out there has the same frustrations.
>
> ~Lyle
>
>
>> [Original Message]
>> From: Carlos Duraes de Carvalho <[log in to unmask]>
>> To: <[log in to unmask]>
>> Date: 6/2/2005 6:25:51 PM
>> Subject: Re: Conus milneedwardsi - why no nominative form?
>>
>> Dear Manolo
>> I have a number of Conus milneedwardsii from Mozambique, none with 46mm,
>> but I have seen some with about 60mmm, so I think 46mm is possible. I
>> agree with you that it is necessary to see the holotype.
>> Best regards to all
>> Carlos www.shellscarvalho.com
>>
>> -----Mensagem original-----
>> De: Conchologists List [mailto:[log in to unmask]] Em nome de
>> Manuel J. Tenorio
>> Enviada: quinta-feira, 2 de Junho de 2005 21:12
>> Para: [log in to unmask]
>> Assunto: Re: Conus milneedwardsi - why no nominative form?
>>
>>
>> Dear friends:
>> This is a very good point. Many other cases like this do in fact exist:
>> an
>> old description in which the name has been commonly used (or misused) to
>> design another completely different species. I haven't checked myself
>> the
>> holotype of milneedwardsi which shoud be in Paris, but I will try.
>> However, the original description is available online. Please check at
>> the
>> wonderful Alan Kohn's site by following this link:
>> http://biology.burke.washington.edu/conus/catalogue/sources/Jousseaume,%
>> 20F.%201894.%20Bull.%20Soc.%20Philom.%20Paris%20(8).%20vi.pdf
>>
>> The article is in french with the original description in latin. What I
>> can say is that apparently Josseaume did described something that sounds
>> like a miniature milneedwardsi (according to our modern standards). It
>> is
>> clearly assigned to the textile group and the high spire is the most
>> relevant character mentioned. The type locality is Aden (Yemen), and all
>> the species described in the article come from the Red Sea. This is odd,
>> because I do not recall that typical milneedwardsii had been found in
>> the
>> Red Sea, at least recently.
>> AS I said before, I must have a look at the holotype, but it could
>> actually happen that the original milneedwardsi resulted to be something
>> different to the "modern" large milneedwardsi, typically from
>> Mozambique.
>> If so, clytospira would probably take its place as nominal species, and
>> then the subspecies from Mozambique would eventually require a new name!
>> What about "conus clytospira conch-lerorum"? ha ha
>>
>> Warmest regards to all
>>
>> Manuel Jimenez Tenorio
>> Jerez, SPAIN
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> [log in to unmask] - a forum for informal discussions on molluscs
>> To leave this list, click on the following web link:
>> http://listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=conch-l&A=1
>> Type your email address and name in the appropriate box and
>> click leave the list.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> [log in to unmask] - a forum for informal discussions on molluscs
>> To leave this list, click on the following web link:
>> http://listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=conch-l&A=1
>> Type your email address and name in the appropriate box and
>> click leave the list.
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> [log in to unmask] - a forum for informal discussions on molluscs
> To leave this list, click on the following web link:
> http://listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=conch-l&A=1
> Type your email address and name in the appropriate box and
> click leave the list.
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
----------------------------------------------------------------------
[log in to unmask] - a forum for informal discussions on molluscs
To leave this list, click on the following web link:
http://listserv.uga.edu/cgi-bin/wa?SUBED1=conch-l&A=1
Type your email address and name in the appropriate box and
click leave the list.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
|
