Non of the species mentioned by Dennis are at this moment on the Cites list.
You can search the list on the Cites web site:
http://www.wcmc.org.uk/CITES/eng/index.shtml
(select the Fauna database and select species)
The International Cites agreement on the international trade of endangered
species should not be mixed up with local (national) laws. Charonia tritonis
for instance is protected by law in Germany. Some other species are
protected under European laws (Pinna nobilis, Patella ferruginea and
others).
Jeroen Goud
> -----Oorspronkelijk bericht-----
> Van: shelloak [SMTP:[log in to unmask]]
> Verzonden: dinsdag 7 december 1999 14:20
> Aan: [log in to unmask]
> Onderwerp: Re: [CONCH-L] Stombus Gigas
>
> When did Charonia lampas get on the CITES list? John Tennessee
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dennis Nieweg <[log in to unmask]>
> To: [log in to unmask] <[log in to unmask]>
> Date: Tuesday, December 07, 1999 6:32 AM
> Subject: Re: Stombus Gigas
>
>
> >Yep, Charonia variegata, Charonia tritonis, Charonia lampas, Pinna
> nobilis,
> >Cypraea esontropia etc etc. Check out cites on the internet. And ofcourse
> no
> >coral!!!!!! Dennis.
> >
> >
> >
> >At 20:59 7-12-99 +1300, you wrote:
> >>I was interested to read some of your messages regarding the CITES laws
> >about taking this shell. I had a rather unpleasant experience earlier in
> the
> >year when I made my first shell purchase over the internet. Having not
> yet
> >found this wonderful newsgroup full of information and advice, I was
> quite
> >naive. I ordered some shells from Shell Horizons, Florida. They seemed
> very
> >reasonably priced and their website showed beautiful examples. Being a
> >beginner I still need a lot of the common shells. I ordered, among
> others,
> 2
> >Stombus Gigas. At the time I had no idea it was an endangered species,
> and
> >there was no mention of this on the website. In fact, they proudly
> display
> >in bold letters: " we do not trade in endangered species". I emailed them
> >several times before placing my order to check things out, and I asked
> >whether a permit was required to export the shells to NZ. I was told no.
> >>When the shipment arrived it was duly inspected by NZ Customs and our
> >Conservation Dept. They identified the Queen Conch shells and siezed
> them.
> I
> >received the remainder of the shells with a very strong letter from
> Customs
> >berating me for ordering these shells and informing me they would be
> destoyed.
> >>I was very upset and concerned, so I phoned the Conservation Dept and
> >Customs and spoke to several people about it. I explained that I had no
> idea
> >it was on the endangered list, and showed them records of emails received
> >from Shell Horizons, etc. They said the shipment should have come with a
> >CITES permit, but eventually agreed that if I could get a belated CITES
> >permit from the seller, they would consider it. Back I went to Shell
> >Horizons to tell them exactly what I thought of the whole thing, and I
> >wasn't happy with the quality of the shells I received either. Nearly all
> of
> >them were badly chipped, cracked or dead and dull.
> >>The guy I dealt with was really rude, saying the shells were "good"
> quality
> >according to him and anyway what do you expect for that price..., and
> that
> >NZ Customs were just a bunch of trouble-making fanatics. He was not at
> all
> >interested in getting me a permit, he insisted that a permit was only
> >required for commercial shipments of a dozen or more. He informed me they
> >sell thousands of them all over the world without trouble. This is not
> legal
> >according to the authorities here. Anyhow, I finally got a refund for the
> 2
> >Strombus Gigas from Shell Horizons, with much grumbling from them.
> >>Anyway, that experience taught me some valuable lessons. It will be a
> while
> >before I even consider another purchase from overseas. In any case the
> >freight charge was nearly as much as the shells, which makes the exercise
> >pointless.
> >>This whole issue of Strombus Gigas being classified as endangered, yet
> >seems to be sold in huge quantities is a real worry. I sent an email to
> the
> >CITES office for the Florida area about it, but I never even received an
> >acknowledgement or reply. It would be quite nice to have a Strombus
> Gigas
> >for my collection, but I certainly do not want to contribute to the trade
> of
> >an endangered species. How would I be able to tell for sure when or where
> a
> >shell was taken - unscrupulous dealers are not going to admit to breaking
> >the law. I think I will just steer clear from this one - there are many
> >other beautiful shells out there that are plentiful.
> >>By the way - any other endangered shells I should be aware of??
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >><!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
> >><HTML><HEAD>
> >><META content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1" http-equiv=Content-Type>
> >><META content="MSHTML 5.00.2919.3800" name=GENERATOR>
> >><STYLE></STYLE>
> >></HEAD>
> >><BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I was interested to read some of your
> messages
> >>regarding the CITES laws about taking this shell. I had a rather
> unpleasant
> >>experience earlier in the year when I made my first shell purchase over
> the
> >>internet. Having not yet found this wonderful newsgroup full of
> information
> >and
> >>advice, I was quite naive. I ordered some shells from Shell
> >>Horizons, Florida. They seemed very reasonably priced and their
> website
> >>showed beautiful examples. Being a beginner I still need a lot of the
> common
> >>shells. I ordered, among others, 2 Stombus Gigas. At the time I had
> no
> >idea
> >>it was an endangered species, and there was no mention of this on the
> website.
> >>In fact, they proudly display in bold letters: " we do not trade in
> endangered
> >>species". I emailed them several times before placing my order to
> >>check things out, and I asked whether a permit was required to
> export
> the
> >>shells to NZ. I was told no.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>When the shipment arrived it was duly
> >>inspected by NZ Customs and our Conservation Dept. They identified the
> Queen
> >>Conch shells and siezed them. I received the remainder of the shells
> with
> a
> >very
> >>strong letter from Customs berating me for ordering these shells and
> informing
> >>me they would be destoyed.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>I was very upset and concerned, so I phoned
> the
> >>Conservation Dept and Customs and spoke to several people about it. I
> >explained
> >>that I had no idea it was on the endangered list, and showed them
> records
> of
> >>emails received from Shell Horizons, etc. They said the shipment should
> have
> >>come with a CITES permit, but eventually agreed that if I could get a
> belated
> >>CITES permit from the seller, they would consider it. Back I went to
> Shell
> >>Horizons to tell them exactly what I thought of the whole thing, and I
> wasn't
> >>happy with the quality of the shells I received either. Nearly all of
> them
> >were
> >>badly chipped, cracked or dead and dull.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>The guy I dealt with was really rude,
> saying
> the
> >>shells were "good" quality according to him and anyway what do you
> expect
> for
> >>that price..., and that NZ Customs were just a bunch of trouble-making
> >fanatics.
> >>He was not at all interested in getting me a permit, he insisted that a
> permit
> >>was only required for commercial shipments of a dozen or more. He
> informed
> me
> >>they sell thousands of them all over the world without trouble. This is
> >>not legal according to the authorities here. Anyhow, I finally got
> a
> >refund
> >>for the 2 Strombus Gigas from Shell Horizons, with much grumbling from
> >>them.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Anyway, that experience taught me some
> valuable
> >>lessons. It will be a while before I even consider another purchase from
> >>overseas. In any case the freight charge was nearly as much as the
> shells,
> >which
> >>makes the exercise pointless.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>This whole issue of Strombus Gigas being
> >classified
> >>as endangered, yet seems to be sold in huge quantities is a real worry.
> I
> sent
> >>an email to the CITES office for the Florida area about it, but I never
> even
> >>received an acknowledgement or reply. It would be quite nice to have a
> >Strombus
> >>Gigas for my collection, but I certainly do not want to contribute to
> the
> >trade
> >>of an endangered species. How would I be able to tell for sure when or
> where a
> >>shell was taken - unscrupulous dealers are not going to admit to
> breaking
> the
> >>law. I think I will just steer clear from this one - there are many
> other
> >>beautiful shells out there that are plentiful.</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>By the way - any other endangered shells I
> should
> >>be aware of??</FONT></DIV>
> >><DIV> </DIV>
> >><DIV> </DIV>
> >><DIV> </DIV>
> >><DIV> </DIV></BODY></HTML>
> >>
> >Dennis C.Nieweg
> >
|
