----------------------------Original message----------------------------
I have added the original message that caused the response from Keenan..just
so that we all know what was said, and to add a context to my statements....
I have also, for the benefit of Keenan and others, added some very brief
answers to Collins'
questions.
Janet Collins original post on Jan 31/96 stated:
>We are trying to redefine what level of service I should be providing to
>my patrons. I am not affiliated with the Main Library and am a
>one-person operation responsible for all aspects of running the Map
>Library. The Map Library houses over 220,000 maps, 1,000 atlases, etc.
>
>I have particularly focused on ArcView2 for several reasons. I think
>that "cheat sheets" can be developed for some cd's that can generate
>maps. Second, ArcView2 is the software we have on hand.
>
>1) Are you learning or have you learned ArcView2 adequately to produce a
> map?
yes. However, to call what ArcView produces a "map" may create some
misconceptions in some peoples minds. It isn't a map in the sense that a
USGS topo, or a Rand McNally State map is a "map". 90%+ of the maps we
"create" are simple outlines that can be used in a students paper or
presentation, or they are combinations of baseline data with numeric census
data to produce a "map" which either never existed before, or was produced
by a government (Canadian) but was cancelled (i.e.: census metropolitan
atlas maps).
>
>2) Are you working with someone who has?
yes. And we also work with other departments, institutions, government
agencies, and the private sector. We provide each other (one sector to the
other, one "type" of service to the other) with mutually supportive and
benefical services. "They" send people to me for certain things, and I send
people to "them" for certain things. each of us, normally, knows the
boundaries of what we can and should provide to our users or clients,
whatever the case may be.
>
>3) Do you:
>
> a) make maps for patrons?
sometimes. most software and databases are not as user friendly to allow
the novice the time to make their own.
> if yes: 1) do you charge for them?
yes..but only for the cost of the paper and ink (not covered in the regular
budgets). this is the same as charging for photocopying.
> 2) what kind of turnaround time do you provide?
it varies from 10 minutes to hours..sometimes days..if the network is down :-)
>
> b) provide consultation if patrons have problems using ArcView2?
yes...but only to a point...when the questions or needs or the user get too
complicated
or outside what we would want to provide, then they are sent to someone
else...often a cartographer, GIS specialist, remote sensing specialist or
whatever....we provide access to the information and some basic map creation
work that extends no further than what is traditional to map collections
(i.e.: non-copyrighted maps, outlines for quick reference or presentation.).
>
> c) point them to the computer and say good luck?
never....
>
> d) differentiate between faculty, staff, students, and off-campus
> users in terms of level of service provided?
I don't ask where they come from....but if it is busy or if a faculty member
comes in with an emergency, most people from "off campus" are the ones who
will say.."oh..I'm sorry...help her first..I am not a student...I can
wait)....people can be very nice (but that is probably due to the famous
Nova Scotian hospitality)
>
>4) If a patron comes in and needs a map that you can't provide (maybe
> due to scale or desired detail and its unlikely to be available
> anywhere else), what do you say or do?
send them to someone who can help..and I do tell them that what they may
need/want will cost money...and I am not able to do it for them....or I try
to find the source somewher, if it is available in another collection.
however, all this depends upon the question and the needs.
I should note (again) that I won't do anything (knowingly) that someone else
will be able to do for money. Now someone could say "everything can be done
in the private sector or for money"...well...if tht's is what will be
coming, then say goodbye to all public institutions!!
(I guess you in the United States have more of a history for pay as you go
then we do in Canada...I guess that's why we have national medical coverage).
>
>5) What level of service (ie mapmaking) do you think we (as Map
> Librarians) should be providing to our patrons?
I think I outlined this throughout my responses. The unfortunate thing for
us (and others in the same area of work...cartographers, geographers..etc.)
is that more and more information is being provided electronically. Is
printing a map from Netscape "making a map" ? Is printing a map from a
cd-rom atlas "making a map". Is making a baseline image on ArcView using
the DCW database making a "map"......
Relative to Keenan's comments, I would say no. And there are obviously some
boundaries to be found between what is cartographic production and what is
simple electronic "map" production from electronic sources in a map library.
>
>
>I'm looking forward to your responses. Please respond directly to me and
>I'll summarize for the list.
I would have sent directly to you, but the comments from L. Keenan (below)
caused me to do otherwise.
>
>Thanks,
>
>Janet Collins
>Huxley Map Library
>Western Washington University
>
>[log in to unmask]
Larry Keenan, on Feb 5/96 responded:
>As a cartographer of 32 years I can assure you that you have undertaken a
>task that is daunting. By your own admission, you are untrained. You have
>no experience, other than that of utilizing ARC View software. You are even
>contemplating going into business, yet have no idea as to how much your
>services are worth. Worse yet, you will probably want to give away data, due
>to guilt.
>
>Please, please, please leave the map making industry alone. We have already
>spent needless amount of hours and money trying to undue the damage that you
>folk have inflicted upon our clients by confusing the issues of GPS, GIS,
>AM/FM, Photogrammetry, Business GIS and DeskTop Mapping. Additionally, you
>above anyone else, should be aware of copyright issues that you may or maynot
>infringe upon.
James Boxall responded on Feb 6/96:
I am uncertain where Collins stated that she was, according to Keenan,
"contemplating going into business". I must admit that I do not know the
particular arrangements at WWU, but from the perspective of my institution
(even though outside the US of A), I would hazard a guess that the map
collections at both WWU and Dalhousie have one thing in common: we are not
in business, never have been, never will (I hope). I provide a service to
students, faculty, staff the generall public and, surprise, people from
the private sector. The service(s) is paid for by the students fees and the
taxpayers.
As for "giving away data", this is most often prevented through copyright.
However, when data is made available (bought or free) for the use of the
users of this collection, then yes, we do provide the data for their
educational or research needs. Most often we are prevented from giving data
to the general public or the private sector - at the insistence of the
private sector I might add! Actually this all makes sense. By my own
definition of what I do, I would not wish to compete with the map making
industry (we in Canada call the combination of GPS, GIS, AM/FM,
automated/desktop cartography..etc...etc...GEOMATICS). And I don't compete.
As for the "damage [we] folk have inflicted upon [your] clients by confusing
the issues of GPS, GIS, AM/FM, Photogrammetry, Business GIS and DeskTop
Mapping", all I can say is IF this happens as much as Keenan suggests, then
perhaps either an apology (collectively from the map library community) or a
meeting of minds, memorandum of understanding, or another quasilegalistic
document/agreement will be needed to make sure we never get so confused, or
overstep our boundaries. I would also be interested to know WHO has done
such damage, HOW often, WHERE, and WHEN.
Also, the statement that we "above anyone else, should be aware of copyright
issues that you may or may not infringe upon" is true. All I can say is that
I have a copyright officier just down the hall from me who makes certain
that I do not put myself, my institution, or even my users into any risk of
copyright infringement. However, the copyright issue(s) is not so easy in
Canada when it comes to maps or spatial data. But that is a much larger
issue. Suffice it to say that we are being very careful...and if we do err,
it is on the side of extreme caution!!
I must admit to being more 'wet behind the ears' and of less experience than
the 32 years that Mr. Keenan has been a cartographer. I would not define
myself as a cartographer, geographer, map librarian or whatever (my job
title is just that, a title for this job.not for me)...I an simply a
teacher. A teacher who helps people find what they need to learn more about
what they want or are curious about.
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"The more complex and sophisticated our systems of
lateral access, the more we sacrifice in the way of depth."
Sven Birkerts (in The Gutenberg Elegies, 1995)
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James Boxall (Map Curator)
Map Collection, Science Services
Killam Library, Dalhousie University
Halifax, Nova Scotia
Canada B3H 4M8
(t) 902-494-3757
(f) 902-494-2062
(e) [log in to unmask]
Host Site for the Association of Canadian Map Libraries and Archives 1996
Annual Meeting
http://is.dal.ca/~gsbrown/acmla96.html
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"What in observation is loose and vague
is in information deceptive and treacherous"
Francis Bacon, 1621
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