--- Begin Forwarded Message ---
Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2000 17:41:58 -0400
From: Kevin Howald <[log in to unmask]>
Subject: Re: Re: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE <fwd>
Sender: Kevin Howald <[log in to unmask]>
Hi Bill -
The key point here is the concept of added-value. Freely available data,
including map data, from the government is usable as-is in most instances.
But those users that require data with greater accuracy or currency will not
mind paying for a data product that is more accurate, easier-to-use, etc.
Nothing is being paid for twice. The best part is the end-user has a choice
of products.
Kevin Howald
[log in to unmask]
----- Original Message -----
From: Johnnie Sutherland <[log in to unmask]>
To: <[log in to unmask]>
Sent: Monday, October 09, 2000 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE <fwd>
> --- Begin Forwarded Message ---
> Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2000 13:28:40 -0700
> From: "Jones, Bill (MLIB)" <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: RE: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE <fwd>
> Sender: "Jones, Bill (MLIB)" <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
> While I appreciate your wanting us to understand that point of view, you
are
> missing the
> most important part of the question really being asked? Should the
> taxpayers have to pay twice
> for federal or any other government information? I say NO public
accessible
> library should pay for information, in any format, that has already been
> paid for in full.
>
> Bill Jones
> [log in to unmask]
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Johnnie Sutherland [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> Sent: Monday, October 09, 2000 1:15 PM
> To: [log in to unmask]
> Subject: Re: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE <fwd>
>
>
> --- Begin Forwarded Message ---
> Date: Mon, 9 Oct 2000 14:17:19 -0500
> From: "Kent D. Lee" <[log in to unmask]>
> Subject: re: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE <fwd>
> Sender: "Kent D. Lee" <[log in to unmask]>
> To: Linda Zellmer <[log in to unmask]>
> Cc: John Sutherland <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
>
> For posting to Maps-L
> RE: Vendor repackaging of public-domain data
>
> Dear Linda, and all,
>
> As one of the vendors who lurks on this list, I have a few words I would
> like to share on this subject:
>
> First, I want to thank the organizers of Maps-L for letting vendors "lurk"
> and even participate at all. Not all library group listserves allow such
> open subscription. (I have asked for years to be included on the Slav-Lib
> (Slavic Librarian) equivalent of this forum, but to date vendors are not
> welcome.) IMHO, vendor participation is important, especially in niche
> areas like maps and Russian publications, because without it I think there
> is less of an opportunity to mitigate the tension that sometimes
> characterizes the library/publisher or library/distributor relationship.
> Dialogue is important, even if us vendors have motives at least partially
> based on the seeking of profit.
>
> Second, I have not explored in detail the National Atlas web site, nor its
> commercial variant. So I do not know anything about the pricing or other
> commercial conditions. But I don't think this is important, since Linda's
> question itself is more generic.
>
> These days more and more publications of all kinds are being "born
digital."
> Vendors--US vendors in particular because of the nature of copyright law
on
> USG-produced publications--have a long history of taking public domain
data,
> adding value, otherwise repackaging it, and then selling it or somehow
> making money from it. Two interesting examples are DeLorme's state atlas
> series, and MapQuest's own Internet site. In the former case, I do not
> think that DeLorme went out and re-surveyed entire states--it seems that
> they took USGS maps, "repackaged them," added value in a number of ways,
> vastly improved distribution and convenience, and have made quite a nice
> profit. With MapQuest (and similar sites, in fact), they have obviously
> used Tiger and other public data as a core component of their database.
> They then repackaged in via an easy-to-use and pretty convenient
interface,
> and furthermore made it free to end users by utilizing a business model
> based on generating ad reven!
> ues from Internet banner ads.
>
> It seems to me that the same thing is going on with the National Atlas.
As
> increasingly more powerful public domain GIS datasets are born digital,
> there will be increasing opportunities for vendors to ingest them, add
> value, and spit out (whoops-careful with the direction of that metaphor!)
> new and maybe even superior publications. Of course, being private
> publishers, they will probably claim copyright for the value-added
aspects,
> and I can see how this would not sit well with many in the library
> community--or even in the USGS or other public sector area. But why is
this
> bad? If a better product has been created, what is wrong? If the vendor
> overprices it or is making "too much" profits, you can be sure that
Company
> B will emerge, download the same source data set, slap on a new, improved
> interface or add other value, and lower the price. It's the American way,
> no?
>
> In the old days when public domain data was mostly paper-based, the
barriers
> to entry for private would-be value-adders was higher. In the digital
age,
> the barriers are much lower. I think we will all be better off by the new
> and innovative products that will emerge. In the meantime I hope that
> public-domain data will not disappear or have restrictions slapped on them
> just because the private sector takes advantage of their existence. Where
> such data are being produced as a part of government doing its normal
work,
> I don't think there is much of a threat to such restrictions. Maybe in
> other areas--for example, some government agencies may engage in in a kind
> of vanity publishing activity and then feel offended when a commercial
> operation swoops by and steals its thunder--I can imagine feelings being
> hurt.
>
> Anyways, my thoughts.
>
> Kent D. Lee
> President/CEO
> East View Cartographic
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> >> --- Begin Forwarded Message ---
> >> Date: Mon, 09 Oct 2000 09:28:25 -0700
> >> From: Linda Zellmer <[log in to unmask]>
> >> Subject: FW: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE
> >> Sender: Linda Zellmer <[log in to unmask]>
>
>
> >> Hello All,
>
> >> This came across my e-mail from Geonet two weeks ago, and I
am
> >> surprised that it did not make it to Maps-L.
>
> >> This company has apparently downloaded the data from the
> National
> >> Atlas web site, repackaged it and is now selling web access to the
> >> National
> >> Atlas and is selling a CD-ROM version as well.
>
> >> The web site version (at least what can be used for free)
> seems to
> >> work faster than the National Atlas on the Web. However, I am not
> amused
> >> by
> >> the commercial aspect. The company does state that they are not
> >> affiliated
> >> with USGS and that it is not THE National Atlas. Somehow I feel a
> little
> >> uneasy about the prospect of data being repackaged and sold.
>
> >> Linda Zellmer
>
> >> *****************************
> >> Linda Zellmer
> >> Maps Librarian
> >> Arizona State University Libraries
> >> P.O. Box 871006
> >> Tempe, AZ 85287-1006
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >> Phone: (480)-965-5973
> >> Fax: (480)-965-0883
>
>
>
> >> -----Original Message-----
> >> From: Carolyn J. Laffoon [mailto:[log in to unmask]]
> >> Sent: Tuesday, September 26, 2000 12:37 PM
> >> To: [log in to unmask]
> >> Subject: USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE
>
>
> >> Subject:
> >> USA NATIONAL ATLAS ONLINE
> >> Date:
> >> Tue, 26 Sep 2000 11:10:19 +0000
> >> From:
> >> "Information Dept." <[log in to unmask]>
> >> Reply-To:
> >> [log in to unmask]
> >> Organization:
> >> CD Vision (USA), INC.
>
>
>
> >> Announcing........US ATLAS 2000 ONLINE
>
>
> >> VISIT OUR WEB SITES :
>
> >> http://www.usatlas2000.com
>
> >> USA National Atlas ONLINE
>
> >> This is the first release of the USA National Atlas data Online
> >> containing:
>
> >> Map data layers compiled by the USGS as part of their National Atlas
> of
> >> USA(tm)Project.
> >> Plus Elevation and Geology
>
>
>
> >> We will continue updating the layers and software as new data become
> >> available
>
> >> Map Layers on THE US Atlas 2000 Online
>
> >> Geology
> >> Elevation
> >> Airports
> >> Principal Aquifers
> >> County Boundaries
> >> Cities & Towns
> >> Major Dams
> >> Federal and Indian Lands
> >> Hydrologic Unit Boundaries
> >> Seismic Events
> >> Streams and Waterbodies
> >> Agricultural Minerals Operations
> >> Construction Minerals Operations
> >> Ferrous Metal Mines
> >> Ferrous Metal Processing Plants
> >> Miscellaneous Industrial Minerals Operations
> >> Nonferrous Metal Mines
> >> Nonferrous Metal Processing Plants
> >> Refractory, Abrasive, and Other Industrial Minerals Operations
> >> Parkways and Scenic Rivers
> >> Railroads
> >> Roads
> >> States
> >> Urban Areas
> >> Volcanos
> >> Abandoned Mine Land Inventory - Coal Mine Related Problems
> >> --- End Forwarded Message ---
> --- End Forwarded Message ---
> --- End Forwarded Message ---
>
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